Psychedelics, Consciousness, and AI | Richard Dawkins | EP 256

Mystical Experiences

Jordan Peterson and Richard Dawkins explore the profound impact of psychedelics on perception and emotion. Jordan explains that psychedelics disinhibit latent inhibition of perception, leading to overwhelming mystical experiences characterized by intense positive and negative emotions. He describes the Amazonian use of ayahuasca, a potent combination of DMT and a monoamine oxidase inhibitor, which has been used for thousands of years to induce such experiences 1. Richard acknowledges the consistency of psychedelic effects across cultures, noting that substances like psilocybin can produce both heavenly and hellish experiences depending on the context 2.

Psychedelics, disinhibit, latent inhibition of perception, and that's why they produce a mystical experience. But the mystical experience, I mean, there's three aspects to it. Let's say there's an overwhelming positive emotion simultaneously. There's overwhelming negative emotion.

--- Jordan Peterson

Jordan also highlights the historical significance of these substances, mentioning how psilocybin was introduced to Western culture and the powerful effects of LSD.

   

Symbolic Imagery

The discussion shifts to the symbolic representations linked to psychedelic experiences and their historical and cultural significance. Jordan elaborates on the concept of the world tree, a symbol found in both Scandinavian and Amazonian cultures, which he believes represents the microcosm to macrocosm vision enabled by psychedelics 3. He also discusses the symbolism of snakes, particularly the dual coiled snake, which is a powerful symbol of healing and transformation 4.

The world tree is a vision of the microcosm to the macrocosm. The tree is used as a metaphor for that. It's so proto scientific idea, intuition of the idea that there's a kind of dimension that constitutes zooming in on things, right to the smallest possible level of apprehension and zooming out to the most general level of apprehension.

--- Jordan Peterson

Richard questions the improbability of such symbols arising independently in different cultures, leading to a deeper exploration of the underlying biological commonalities that might explain these patterns.

   

Expanded Consciousness

Jordan and Richard delve into the idea that psychedelics can expand consciousness to perceive deeper levels of reality. Jordan shares his personal experiences with high doses of psilocybin, describing how it allowed him to feel his consciousness travel down to the micro level, even to the point of perceiving DNA structures 5. Richard remains skeptical but acknowledges the profound nature of such experiences.

I have taken extremely high doses of psilocybin. Like, four doses is enough, basically, to knock you out of your body. I wouldn't recommend it casually. I took 7 grams three times and I had this shamanic experience. It was unbelievable.

--- Jordan Peterson

The conversation also touches on the relationship between consciousness and the complexity of living forms, with Jordan suggesting that consciousness might shape biological being through processes like sexual selection 6.